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Invunche |
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The oil is not being privatized. Oil companies are right now bidding on contracts that will include the rebuilding/expansion of the oil infrastructure, but the
control of profit stays on Iraqi hands.
I have never had time for privileged people in safe countries who announce that they cannot see the difference between democracy and dictatorship. I gave
up on Amnesty International when it said that Guantanamo Bay, in which the guards killed no one, was the modern equivalent of Stalin's Gulag, through which
the secret police killed millions. - Nick Cohen
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Propaganster |
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Invunche wrote:That's the official story - I don't buy it. ~Nothing is more dangerous than an independent thought~ |
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Invunche |
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You don't buy it because you suffer from the meme that the war was about oil.
I have never had time for privileged people in safe countries who announce that they cannot see the difference between democracy and dictatorship. I gave
up on Amnesty International when it said that Guantanamo Bay, in which the guards killed no one, was the modern equivalent of Stalin's Gulag, through which
the secret police killed millions. - Nick Cohen
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Rambo123UK |
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Or maybe we don't buy it because of all the other hundreds (935, IIRC) that we've been told by the same people.
One ought never to turn one's back on a threatened danger and try to run away from it. If you do that, you will double
the danger. But if you meet it promptly and without flinching, you will reduce the danger by half. Sir Winston
Churchill
--- Bible Babble
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Propaganster |
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Invunche wrote:What was it about then? And please, don't mention anything that makes this invasion look, in any shape or form, "humanitarian." ~Nothing is more dangerous than an independent thought~ |
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Rambo123UK |
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WMDs. Oh no, wait...
One ought never to turn one's back on a threatened danger and try to run away from it. If you do that, you will double
the danger. But if you meet it promptly and without flinching, you will reduce the danger by half. Sir Winston
Churchill
--- Bible Babble
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Invunche |
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Luckily I don't have the responsibility of answering that question.
I have never had time for privileged people in safe countries who announce that they cannot see the difference between democracy and dictatorship. I gave
up on Amnesty International when it said that Guantanamo Bay, in which the guards killed no one, was the modern equivalent of Stalin's Gulag, through which
the secret police killed millions. - Nick Cohen
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Propaganster |
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It amazes me that otherwise rational and intelligent people cannot see that oil was an obvious motivation to launch this invasion and continue to more or
less condone this war. If not for their oil, quite frankly, the western nations would have little interest in these countries found in what is refered to as
the Arab world, and coincidentally enough, the West also would have little interest in "securing the sovereignty" of Israel which essentially insures
the presence of a western-like power in what is de facto muslim territory.
~Nothing is more dangerous than an independent thought~ |
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Invunche |
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It amazes me you think your view is rational considering you don't have a shred of evidence.
I guess it's always obvious to the believer.
I have never had time for privileged people in safe countries who announce that they cannot see the difference between democracy and dictatorship. I gave
up on Amnesty International when it said that Guantanamo Bay, in which the guards killed no one, was the modern equivalent of Stalin's Gulag, through which
the secret police killed millions. - Nick Cohen
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Propaganster |
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Things must be rather obvious to you then, Invunche. It seems to me that you are the one prepared to believe the 'official story.' Or maybe you
don't have to believe anything - the questions are not yours to answer.
The legacy of lies of this Bush Administration is well documented. Jim mentionned WMD's (which were never found) but that was actually the second excuse they used when they failed to produce any sort of evidence for the initial motive - A link with Al Qaeda. Today, I believe this war is about 'Bringing peace and democracy in Iraq.' This is typical - the USA always has a 'humanitarian mission' with its wars. I sort of got the impression oil was an issue when Bush urged the Iraqis to protect it, and the promise along the lines of "No worries, the oil will pay for the war." It also seems that when the oil is threatened - the US is very quick to act (remember Kuwait?). Propping up dictators over there has been a good business decision - it's more cost effective to make a few leaders handsomely rich than to actually try to make life better for the entire population. Other than oil, what is it that we get from those countries, exactly? But you're right... oil was not a motivation. It's just that we're oil addicted countries and that they have plenty of it.
~I was told there is a God and I could have believed it - problem is, I actually thought about it~ |
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Invunche |
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That's not even circumstantial evidence. Other that the left-wing mantra that the war was about oil there's nothing in the real world to suggest anyone
is stealing th oil profits from Iraq.
I have never had time for privileged people in safe countries who announce that they cannot see the difference between democracy and dictatorship. I gave
up on Amnesty International when it said that Guantanamo Bay, in which the guards killed no one, was the modern equivalent of Stalin's Gulag, through which
the secret police killed millions. - Nick Cohen
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Propaganster |
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Invunche wrote:You're right - Facts and evidence are separate things. The western economies, and this is predominantly true in North America, are based on transport. The lack of an alternative to petrol has maintained a strong dependency on oil - That's fact. Our dealings with the Arab world, in terms of economy and trade, are based on their capacity to produce and export oil - That's fact. The West's foreign policy over there has lead to, or maintained totalitarian regimes (strong US support for Hussein, the Shah placed in power following a democratic election in Iran, the regime in Saudi Arabia was literally put there by the US and its allies) - That's fact. The "Iraqi government" was scheduled in the summer of last year to award no-bid contracts to Exxon, Mobil, BP, Shell and Total - That's fact. Bush and much of the higher members of his Administration have shares in the oil industry and profited immensely from this war at a time when Big Oil was announcing record benefits - That's fact. Need I go on? I don't conveniently overlook the facts and the history at work in my analysis of the probable motivations which lead to this war. ~I was told there is a God and I could have believed it - problem is, I actually thought about it~
Last Edited By: Propaganster
25/01/09 18:29:50.
Edited 2 times.
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Rambo123UK |
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One ought never to turn one's back on a threatened danger and try to run away from it. If you do that, you will double
the danger. But if you meet it promptly and without flinching, you will reduce the danger by half. Sir Winston
Churchill
--- Bible Babble
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Invunche |
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I would like to see a list of people in the Bush administration who have supposedly benefited economically from the war.
I have never had time for privileged people in safe countries who announce that they cannot see the difference between democracy and dictatorship. I gave
up on Amnesty International when it said that Guantanamo Bay, in which the guards killed no one, was the modern equivalent of Stalin's Gulag, through which
the secret police killed millions. - Nick Cohen
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Propaganster |
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For starters: The Bush family itself has an abundance of shares in the oil industry. Dick Cheney was a chief executive of the Haliburton oil company in which
he held stock options. Commerce secretary Don Evans has stock in Tom Brown Inc, an oil exploration company; that stock value is now estimated at 25M$.
Condoleeza Rice was a director at Chevron.
That information is not too hard to find. The Bush Administration has been called "The oil and gas Administration" numerous times - maybe you had your head in the sand at the time. ~I was told there is a God and I could have believed it - problem is, I actually thought about it~ |
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Rambo123UK |
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maybe you had your head in the sand at the time. Maybe because he was digging in the desert for those WMDs.
One ought never to turn one's back on a threatened danger and try to run away from it. If you do that, you will double
the danger. But if you meet it promptly and without flinching, you will reduce the danger by half. Sir Winston
Churchill
--- Bible Babble
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Invunche |
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No no no. I know all about the accusations. They are repeated often. What I wanna see is specifics.
I have never had time for privileged people in safe countries who announce that they cannot see the difference between democracy and dictatorship. I gave
up on Amnesty International when it said that Guantanamo Bay, in which the guards killed no one, was the modern equivalent of Stalin's Gulag, through which
the secret police killed millions. - Nick Cohen
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VenusHalley |
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Invunche wrote:all western involvement on the ME was about oil and money. All involvement in foreign wars is usually about geostrategic interests... really, why aren't we in darfur? Why did not we try to save chechnya? Why don't we hear about Belarus more often? let's not pretend we are all altruist in exporting democracy. Because that is not the truth.
If we want to find real sense of life We need to give up its luxuries Cause I don't believe in war And I don't believe in peace |
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Tiglibud |
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Invunche |
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Iraqi death researcher censured http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/h...d/middle_east/7869317.stm
Science flies you to the moon. Religion flies you into buildings. - Victor Stenger
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